Interview With University Dean of Students

Dr. Efrem Nulman

The Office of Student Services is located on the fourth floor of Furst Hall, but for many students it may as well be an exotic locale; heard of and spoken about, but misunderstood and shrouded in mystery. In an attempt to demystify the office, its occupants, and its mission, The Commentator interviewed Dr. Efrem Nulman, University Dean of Students. Nulman is a PhD. in psychology with over twenty years experience working with adolescent and young adults. His last fourteen years have been spent in various capacities at YU, while concurrently doing independent research into addictive behavior and family therapy. He spoke with an added emphasis on the incoming students who are unfamiliar with YU and may be bewildered by the array of issues they may have to contend with.

The Commentator:

The Office of Student Services is an unknown quantity for many students here at the University. What is the job of the Office of Student Services?

Dean Nulman:

First and foremost, it is to provide students with a series of services that will hopefully be useful to them throughout their college careers. Counseling services for personal, psychological, and social issues; assistance with student activities; helping students deal with the maze and bureaucracy of being in YU; housing problems; more or less anything that is outside the classroom where we can be helpful our job is precisely that, to try to help students with whatever problems they face.

The Commentator:

So any aspect of student life that is not academic falls under the purview of Student Services?

Dean Nulman:

Specific services that fall under our office include housing, counseling, international student advisement, student activities, student government, disciplinary and psychiatric procedures, medical services, and things of that nature. These are directly under Student Services. Matters such as food services and security report to different areas, but we have a close working relationship with them. If there are issues that concern students or that need to be communicated in regard to those services our office should be the place to which they would come and we would try to be helpful. Our job is to advocate for student needs, and to implement what we think and what students think is best to really improve the quality of student life on campus.

The Commentator:

You say that you and your office represent the students on a variety of different issues. Why should a student with a problem come to you?

Dean Nulman:

That is a very good question. A student should come to us because we have a staff that is competent to deal with any of the issues that they might present to us in any of the areas described in my prior answer. I also understand why they wouldn't come to us, and frankly, over the last years that I have been in Yeshiva what I view as my greatest failure has been an inability to communicate effectively to students that the real reason they should come is not just professional competence, but that we really care about them as people.

The Commentator:

Your office is definitely seen as part of the administration, and students have an us-versus-them mentality. How is a student coming to your office with problems or complaints assured that you are going to help him?

Dean Nulman:

I don't know if he should be sure we are going to help him, but he can be sure that we are going to try. But he won't know that until he comes. Now I can tell you, if I want to get into it statistically, that roughly half of the student body did come to us for something within the categories of what we do during the course of the last academic year. That has been pretty consistent throughout the years. But yet, there is still a feeling that I pick up amongst students that we don't really care, or as you said, we are part of the administration, which is true, we are part of the administration on the one hand….

The Commentator:

Look, students in this university know that on the average the administration is far more concerned with development, fund-raising, public relations, spin, etc., then they are with student concerns. The consumer is supposed to be king, and in this university every student knows that is not true. Why should that be different in your office?

Dean Nulman:

Well, I don't want to speak to the other parts of the university in which what you said may or may not be so. What I do want to clearly speak to, is that to students the main issue is trust. And you are right, there is no way that any young adult in college is going to fully trust an administrator in a university. That is not just simply done; we have to earn it. So part of what I am saying is come to us, and let us earn it.

Students have the impression that if they come to us with an extremely personal or serious problem, firstly, they will not have privacy, and worse yet, they are going to be "busted" for whatever their behavior is. If a person comes for me for disciplinary reasons, yeah, they are going to be "busted" for whatever they might have done. But if a person comes to our office for help, then our job is to provide within a context of confidentiality the help that they need. Obviously, where there is a case of someone trying to harm themselves or others there is no confidentiality. But otherwise, there is. Furthermore, our job is to helpful, not to bust students; that is not what we view our role as doing, and that is not what we want to do, period. One of the things our office handles is disciplinary problems. So when there is a disciplinary problem within the institution we will be informed about it, there is going to be a clear procedure. A student will have the opportunity to be heard. There will be a decision, and then they will have the opportunity to appeal it, usually to me. This is with non-academic disciplinary matters.

But ninety to ninety-five percent of the matters we deal with are not disciplinary in nature. They are students who are coming, or ought to feel that they should come to us for help. In those cases, a student has to be reassured that they are going to be able to do this in a context of privacy and trust; that there will be a relationship with people who truly care about them, and that they are not going to be busted if they tell us something that otherwise might come to us in a different way.

The Commentator:

So if a student comes to you and has committed what under the student code of YU is considered a disciplinary infraction, you are guaranteeing that student confidentiality and privacy?

Dean Nulman:

If they are not going to harm themselves or others, we are going to say clearly that we are not there to bust them, we are there to help them, period. That is the instructions to the staff, that is what I do personally, and that is what we will do across the board. I urge students to come and test us.

The Commentator:

How are students going to know that you are for real?

Dean Nulman:

They are going to talk to each other. I can tell you, obviously without giving names, talk to people who have been here and they will tell you that what I said has been true. You are right, students won't know it and will always have doubts, so test it and find out for yourself. If there are issues that concern you, we can help. Whether its simple stuff, such as anxiety and panic when taking an exam, or problematic study habits, to the more complex social issues that people deal with, to issues having to do with anxiety and depression up to the extremes of drugs, alcohol and suicide. If people are having problems in these types of areas, then come to us and we will do everything within our power to be helpful to you. All I can say, is go out and ask students who have talked to us and worked with us and I think what you will find for the most part is that we do have tremendous concern for the well-being of our students. But we cannot just say it. We have to prove it each day anew. And I am asking the student body to give us that chance to try to be helpful, knowing full well that you may not trust us because we are part of the administration, I totally understand that.

The Commentator:

What if a student comes to your offices and he does not trust you or he feels that the services that you are offering are not adequate for his problems?

Dean Nulman:

We have a panel of professional psychiatrists, psychologists, and social workers, and where appropriate, we will make referrals to those people. They are not members of the YU administration; they are not listed as part of the staff; you pay for them on your own; and your relationship in terms of payment is between you and them, ensuring confidentiality. It is a private service and we will be glad to make the referrals for the students who need them.

The Commentator:

Do you think that there is a perceived stigma within the Jewish community for anyone who cries for help or any young person who is perceived as being different from the rest of the pack of his or her colleagues?

Dean Nulman:

Well yes, I do think there is a stigma. I think the Jewish community needs to do a lot more to recognize that there are problems. And then, to limit judgmental and negative reactions to people who have problems and people who are really in pain, or experiencing loss or suffering. As Jews and as people, our first obligation is to show compassion, and to direct people to get the kind of help that they need, not to stigmatize them. I fully realize that there is within the Orthodox community more of a stigma; less than there was, but way more than there should be. I truly believe so, and this has been my experience over the last twenty years. My hope is that people will do what is truly Jewish and have compassion. If a person is stuck with a problem in life, encourage them to get the help they need. Don't discourage them by judging them, or looking down on them in any way. That holds for any problem; from the simple to the extreme. Our job is not to judge people, it is to help them.

The Commentator:

YU is part of the modern world and in certain aspects we are no different then any other national university. There is a significant percentage of the student body that use or abuse drugs and alcohol. Drug and alcohol usage is in violation of the disciplinary code of YU, and grounds for expulsion from housing or from the university. In theory, your office is the place to turn for help, yet at the same time you can "bust" them as well. Why should a student feel comfortable turning to you for help?

Dean Nulman:

You used the word significant to describe the problem. As I said last year to The Observer, there is a growing drug and alcohol problem within the Jewish community in general. This obviously affects Jewish schools as well, and we are not unique in feeling this effect. I would differ with you in your use of the word significant.

Having said all that, if a student is going to break the rules and get caught, they will pay the price for breaking a rule of the school, and a very serious rule at at that; something we will not tolerate within the school. On the other hand, if a student comes to us because they want help, and they are volunteering to us that they need help, then our job is to help them. A student abusing drugs or alcohol should come to us because they are having a problem and they need help, and we care about them and we want to be helpful. Most importantly, when you are playing around with things like this you are playing around with your physical well-being, and when someone plays around with their physical (as well as emotional) well-being, we have an obligation as I see it to try and be helpful to them. That is what we will do. Our job is then, is not to "bust." It is to be helpful in that area. But if student is caught, they will be busted, and they will pay the price.

The Commentator:

So you are saying, that if you have two students in the exact same position with the same issues to deal with, and one student walks into your door -- he has your guarantee of confidentiality and will not be busted. But if the second student is caught by his dorm counselor or security on the exact same matter he will face disciplinary action?

Dean Nulman:

What the outcome is going to be you judge on a case by case and student by student basis. Even in discipline cases one is going to take a very firm stand, but one is going to make a judgement. That does not only apply to drugs and alcohol, that applies to anything. Not every student who misuses the computer room, for example, is going to be asked to leave the school even though they have broken the disciplinary code. We are going to make a judgement by taking a look at the whole person, and we will see what is the best thing we can do for the individual and for the school in these circumstances.

If a student comes to us however, and says I have a problem in any one of numerous areas, again, our job is to try to help him. Who is told about that is also dependent on the relationship we form with the student. In most of the circumstances that I have dealt with students have at one point wanted to bring their parents into the mix in some way….

The Commentator:

Even if the student is adamantly against parental involvement?

Dean Nulman:

We will deal with that depending on what the issue is. If there is a potential harm to themselves or to others, then they are going to have no choice in terms of parental involvement. If they are doing something that is clearly not harming themselves or others, then we will first build a relationship with them to see what is it that we need to do to be helpful, because you don't do the same thing every time. Yet the overall context is yes, there is privacy. How far that privacy extends depends on the circumstances of what is presented, as well as some of what a student wants as you build a relationship with them.

The Commentator:

There is definitely a segment of the YU student population, both here and downtown at Stern, that is sexually active. There is a lack of information and resources on campus concerning safe sex and sexually transmitted diseases. What does your office offer to a student walking in your door?

Dean Nulman:

The same as we offer for any problem. We also have the medical professionals from Beth Israel on campus who are knowledgeable and trained to deal with these areas, and we will ask them to be helpful in guiding students in this regard as well.

The Commentator:

Any closing remarks to the student body and the incoming students in particular?

Dean Nulman:

I am hopeful that students who are new here feel that they will have a good experience and will feel welcomed on campus, and if they do encounter difficulties, small or large, we hope that they will come in and talk to us. For students who are returning, we hope they will give us a shot and give us a chance, and will come forward when there is a problem and they need our help.